Staying True to Yourself with Cary Carbonaro

00:00
Charlie Van Derven
Welcome to another episode of RIA Collective. I'm your host, Charlie Van Derven. Thank you for being here. Everybody's time is very valuable for you to take time out of your day to learn from people who have gone through that path to independence. We appreciate you taking the time. I am joined today by guest who I would say, Cary, you have a different path than anybody I've spoken to, maybe not over the years, but at least as an interview for RIA Collective. This is going to be really an eye-opening interview. Let me welcome to the show Cary Carbonaro of Greater Orlando. I'll tell you, she's been with JP and City and Goldman and also had her own RIA. We're going to learn from Cary's experience in this industry. If we say there are many paths and financial services, Cary's going to back that up today. 

00:54
Charlie Van Derven
I know that. So, Cary, welcome. 

00:55
Cary Carbonaro
Thank you so much. Also, you've got United Capital. 

00:58
Charlie Van Derven
United Capital is in there as well. And there was one more there was. 

01:02
Cary Carbonaro
A stone gate that was like an interim place. 

01:07
Charlie Van Derven
Okay, well, we're going to get into all that, Cary. We'll get into all that now. It was fun because our conversation right before we hit the record button was all about talking to clients and statements just came out. Of course, it's October, as people listen to this, maybe two years from now and the environment is a little different. It's October 2022 right now, and the market has been so great for a few months here. So investors are emotional about their money. Cary, how are those conversations going? 

01:34
Cary Carbonaro
So, yeah, I'm talking people off the ledge daily. It's very interesting because this is when people start to lose it. We're ten months into a downturn, and it's ugly. We haven't been here since ‘08 - ‘09. It's been 13 years since we've been here and everybody forgets it except for me. That's what I'm here for. And also 9/11. I go back to 9/11 and I go back to ‘08 - ‘09 and I go back to here we are now. It's been a very long time span if you look at that time frame. 9/11 took 18 months to get out of it, and financial crisis took 13 months. Right now we're ten months into this one. I'm telling everyone we are at least halfway through because I don't expect it to be longer than 9/11, which would be 20 months. And so I just don't see that. But we'll see. 

02:26
Cary Carbonaro
I just feel like there's a million ways we can get pulled out. I don't know when it's going to be, but I just don't think it's going to be that much longer. I'm telling them end of year, beginning of next year. I think I should be right with that prediction. Not that I have a piece of ball other than how long we can be down. It's funny because the longer the time, the more people start to lose patience. 

02:46
Charlie Van Derven
Oh, sure. Oh sure, yeah. Well, then I'll tell you what, 9/11. I would say there are some complexities with 9/11 that really don't impact us today. I mean, every downturn is different. We had dotcom bust at that time as well. 

02:59
Cary Carbonaro
Right. 

02:59
Charlie Van Derven
Probably the two were very much associated. I know that because I was working for a were talking about doing websites for … you were on the banking side of City … We were doing websites on the wealth management side of City. Interesting time. Now here's one thing I do know about downturns, is if you are taking good care of your clients, if you are communicating often, you will retain and this is a time for growth also. Right. Because when you're getting 10%, 12%, 15%  returns in good times and maybe higher, that relationship with the advisor client relationship is that much stronger. You're really demonstrating value. Whereas if there's advisors right now that aren't communicating with their clients consistently, it actually opens up opportunity for those advisers who are out there and active. 

03:49
Cary Carbonaro
Right. Well, so, unfortunately, I am not out there and active right now. I am in the middle of running out my noncompete, which is a six-month non-compete and I have six and a half weeks left, but who's counting? 

04:01
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah, and like I said, we'll probably wait until after that non-compete to publish. So we'll hold back a little bit. That's some of the fun is the wrong word. It's not fun on your side, but it is enlightening. It's going to be an eye opening conversation for a lot of people who our listeners Cary. And we're growing pretty quickly here. Most of those people are at the warehouse right now. They're in a position they didn't expect themselves to be in. They're not really feeling a fiduciary because they're serving a firm as opposed to serving a client or first client second. You've been through a lot of evolution within the industry. I called it a roller coaster. Now, I don't mean that negatively whatsoever, but you started in this kind of captive environment right. More banking side to my understanding of JP and cities. 

04:57
Cary Carbonaro
Well, no, actually I started yes, I started in the banks, but I didn't have my own wealth management shop back then. I started in the banks, I started in a different role at the banks. I started with JPMorgan Chase in the management training program, and then I went in their executive training program after I got my MBA. I was not serving clients as a wealth manager at that time. 

05:21
Charlie Van Derven
Okay, cool. You've got that banking experience and that leads to I mean, we're talking 20 years ago now when you started your first RIAA, that's family financial research. 

05:33
Cary Carbonaro
Yes. 

05:34
Charlie Van Derven
That's a big transition. 

05:36
Cary Carbonaro
Yeah. I went from the banking world to running marketing for Lord Abbott, which was the mutual fund firm, so I have lots and lots of different skill sets, which is positive and negative because I'm definitely very hard to put in a box and so I definitely don't fit in a box. I think it's good to have all the skill sets but most people just don't really know what to do with me and especially recruiters and things like that. Anyway, so I ran marketing for Lord Abbott and actually digital also. I was head of Digital Wealth because I had all the background with the websites and back in the day, the early eCommerce stuff. So then I went, after Lord Abbott, that's when I started my own RIA from scratch. 

06:27
Charlie Van Derven
Okay, but again, quite a transition, right? You're in leadership positions on the bank side of the industry. Lord Abbott. What's the mindset, how do you make that decision to go from those roles in the industry to independent? Starting your own RIAA, a shift from bankside to wealth management, what is that? 

06:51
Cary Carbonaro
Yeah, it was interesting. I had my CFP early on before they even had the test, before they even had the comprehensive test. That's how long ago I had it. I had let it go because I wasn't using it. And then I decided to get it. Well, so I relocated from New York City to Central Florida in around 9/11 time. It was a good time to leave New York at that moment. And so I started in. So here I am in central Florida. I'm overqualified for every single job that was around. Like, first I half my salary, then I quartered my salary. I said, I'm not getting out of bed for this. I said, I'm going to have to dust off my CFP off the shelf and start taking clients. It was interesting because at the time, the Financial planning magazine and whatever, our magazines in our world were like ranking the top advisers. 

07:53
Cary Carbonaro
At the time probably, I would say maybe 60% to 70% of them were fee only raas rather than broker dealers. I was like, I guess I'll go that way. I guess I'll go that route just because that seems like most people are successful, that route. That route is harder and harder to get clients and all that other stuff. Anyway, that's the route I decided to go because I always wanted to be a Fiduciary. Also from working for a mutual fund firm, like, I knew what it took to have somebody drop a ticket, so to speak, and sell their product. What happened the night before it's for that to happen. I was like, yeah, I'm not going that route. I'm going to go a different route. I really care about my clients and I'm going to do what's right for the client. I had to dust my CFP off the shelf and it wound up I actually had to retake the test and I had to retake the board exam. 

08:46
Cary Carbonaro
I wound up retaking the board exam and then I wound up teaching the CFP nationally for a lot of years. I stopped that with the financial crisis of ‘08 - ‘09. Anyway, I'm sorry, I'm talking too much, asking questions. 

08:59
Charlie Van Derven
By all means. No, listen, I just kind of guide conversation here, Cary. I mean, I got the easy job, right? I want to learn your story. Talk more. Talk as much as you want to, because we want to. Here's who we're serving. Those who have listened to past episodes of Raclective have heard the story already. I started doing websites, I don't know, late 90s. Right? A lot of things have changed in the industry. You're in maybe a handful of years before I was. Of course, we played both two very different roles, me as an outside vendor serving the industry. The one trend I've watched happen is this migration, and it only speeds up now, right? This migration from that captive environment to a true Fiduciary RIA. You can call yourself fiduciary and work for a wirehouse, but I would question the truth of that when you're serving firm quotas and things like that. 

09:53
Cary Carbonaro
Well, and also your allegiance is to the firm. 

09:55
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Yeah. Frankly, it's their clients for the most part. 

10:00
Cary Carbonaro
Yeah. You don't even own them. Right. 

10:01
Charlie Van Derven
We'll get to that noncompete in a little while along those lines. No, I want to hear your story. You talk as much as you can. As much you want to, sure. 

10:09
Cary Carbonaro
Okay. I built my own firm from pretty much 2002, early to 2089, which is the financial crisis, right? So, unfortunately, then I went through a divorce, and it was a very, very complicated divorce because he had his hands in my RAA, even though he wasn't working in the RAA, but he had a lot of threats and he did a lot of terrible things to me during that time frame. My attorney said, you have to move the RIA out of family financial and protect yourself and your clients and move it to another firm. At that time, I went with this firm called Stone Gate, which was pretty much a stopgap for me at that moment in time. Unfortunately, it was longer than I expected because my divorce took four years. 

11:02
Charlie Van Derven
Wow. 

11:02
Cary Carbonaro
It took from eight to the end of 2011. 

11:09
Charlie Van Derven
Let's pause for a second there. So there's a lesson there, right? I mean, this is your business. Of course you're married. I mean, my wife Carmen and I, we share social advisors. RA Collective is a great podcast trying to get back to the industry to some degree. Social advisors is how we afford our living. Now we've 15 years married. Everything seems really great. I can only speak for one of us, but things seem really great. I can imagine a moment where they're not anymore, and that makes the business really separating. That aspect would be very difficult. What advice do you have based on that? 

11:49
Cary Carbonaro
My story is extreme, so I don't know if my situation would be the same for most people, but I had of a situation on the other side. My ex husband was an ex attorney, non practicing, ex hedge fund person. Not non practicing, and also a CPA. Non practicing. Because he had his hands in my stuff, he had access to my Fidelity accounts, he had access to my client accounts. He was the technology and the attorney and compliance of all my stuff. He could get into anything and he threatened to get into everything. One of the things he threatened was that he was going to turn my family financial research website into a gay p*** site. 

12:51
Charlie Van Derven
Seems like a nice guy. 

12:52
Cary Carbonaro
Yeah. 

12:55
Charlie Van Derven
As you reflect on that, I don't want to dive too deep into that and share what you want to Cary, but I'm not trying to pull any more of that out. As you start that RIA and you're happily married, I'm assuming at the time that you start the RIA and there's a lot of people listening who are happily married and thinking about starting the RA, could you have structured that differently to protect yourself in the case that the unforeseen would happen? 

13:21
Cary Carbonaro
Honestly, I owned it 100%, so it wasn't a matter of at all. Went into mediations and divorce depositions and all that stuff where he would say, I work for the RIA and I can't get employment anywhere else. The judges were like, Are you kidding me? You're a licensed CPA and attorney. You can get employment. But it was what it was. But it was mine 100%. And so that was the good thing. It's just that you could have access to things and, like, in the middle of the night, flip a switch and move to another firm so that he could not have access anymore. 

14:10
Charlie Van Derven
Got you. So painful time. We grow out of that. Right. That pain creates growth as well. 

14:17
Cary Carbonaro
Right. That pain actually led me to United Capital. 

14:20
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah. Cool. And so Stonegate leads to United Capital. How does that transition happen? 

14:27
Cary Carbonaro
I knew that I was waiting for a large national RIAA because I had grown too big for Stonegate, and it just wasn't working for me at that time. I wanted large. I wanted a big presence. I wanted to make an impact. I wanted to get back because I pretty much had four years of going through my divorce where I was pretty much dead on the planet. I reemerged in 2012 at united Capital, which was a fantastic move for me. I had to wait to sign any agreements until I was officially divorced. Nobody would touch me until that horrible chapter ended. So that chapter ended December of eleven. I started United Capital in 2012. I came aboard United Capital and had a great run with United Capital. I mean, from 2012 to 2019. It was absolutely fantastic. I did a lot of roles at United Capital. 

15:23
Cary Carbonaro
My last year before Goldman, I was head of women's leadership. I was the voice of the woman. I was a thin life coach. I had a diamond level practice at United Capital. So it was really great. I would wake up every day and say, I can't believe how great my life is. Everything was great. Everything was operating on all cylinders. People were like, wow, you've got it going on. And I was like, yeah, I do. It was really good. 

15:54
Charlie Van Derven
I love that. 

15:54
Cary Carbonaro
Until it wasn't until golden. 

15:57
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah, we'll get there. We'll get there. I want to learn along the way. So you got a four year gap. 

16:04
Cary Carbonaro
Yeah. 

16:05
Charlie Van Derven
Right. Were you able to retain any assets whatsoever? How do you handle that? 

16:10
Cary Carbonaro
I literally barely hang on to what I had. I could not grow during that time frame. It was four years of no growth, only retention. It was very even difficult for the retention. If it wasn't for my number two, I mean, I owe him. I owe him my life. He knows I owe him my life. He's still with me. We've been together for a long time. I got him right out of college. He's now in his late thirtys and he's been with me ever since. He kept it together during that time frame because, I mean, I was in depositions like twenty four, seven. Every day there was something where, my ex husband was coming at me with some horrible thing to try to destroy my life. It took all I had to just get through the day. I couldn't think about growing my practice. And it was also the beginning. 

16:59
Cary Carbonaro
The financial crisis, too. 

17:00
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah. Right. Just throw something else on top of it. Right. This is a recurring theme, right? There's a recurring theme in all the conversations. I think all of them, but if not all of them, most of them, the people you surround yourself with, or in your case, the number two, the person you surround yourself with, is so key for the future. Right. We got a great team. If it's not for Mindy Clink on my team, I don't want to leave anybody out, but I will focus on mindy is amazing, and I'll call her my one A or my one B. She's not my number two. I mean, I think I'm number two most days. 

17:40
Cary Carbonaro
Right, I agree. 

17:42
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah. We're only as good as those people. We surround ourselves with. That's something that comes up in almost every conversation. For those of you listening, like the team you build understand the infrastructure you create is a huge part of the battle. 

17:57
Cary Carbonaro
Right. It's interesting because there was one thing that we always talk about, or we used to talk about at Capital where matching and so, you've got a finder and you've got a minder and that's super important because if you've got two finders or two minders, it's not going to work. I'm a finder and he's a minder. I bring clients in and he takes care of clients and it's so key because you cannot run a practice without having both. Super strong. 

18:30
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah, agreed. That's awesome. Yeah, thanks for echoing that because honestly it comes up in almost every conversation. Right. It is really just so important in who you let into your world and the role they play there. United capital was awesome. 

18:45
Cary Carbonaro
Amazing. 

18:46
Charlie Van Derven
And then were they required by Goldman? 

18:48
Cary Carbonaro
Is that what AI transcription was? In 2019 went for a regular recapitalization because we had the original private equity people still in our firm and they were in our firm for, at that point, I think it was like eleven years and private equity does not want to wait eleven years to get their money out. Usually it's three to five years max and they were waiting to get their money out. Went for a regular recapitalization where Joe and team did a roadshow and tried to get a new private equity money in to buy the old out. Unfortunately we got an offer from or sorry, Joe got an offer from golden that he couldn't refuse. We had no say in the matter as partners and the next thing we knew were sold. Kind of like child. 

19:38
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah. Wow. 

19:41
Cary Carbonaro
Literally, you've got to think about it. United Capital was independent, RIA, changing the world with financial planning. We were moving and shaking, were leading the industry, were doing all these fantastic things and then we literally go to the complete opposite of what we are and what we stood for. 

20:02
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah. I certainly don't want to cast anything on Joe, but how is that as a team who's thriving for nine years, right. And you come up with well actually. 

20:12
Cary Carbonaro
I wasn't even in the beginning, so it was longer than nine years. United was probably twelve years when it was sold. 

20:19
Charlie Van Derven
Okay. Yeah. What does that do? You enter Goldman, you got a whole different, the environment changes overnight were acquired. 

20:32
Cary Carbonaro
We now had like here's Goldman and here's us. It was not we get to operate as United. 

20:41
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah. It was gobbled up and just absorbed. 

20:45
Cary Carbonaro
Off the face of the earth gone by. So sad. Everything that we stood for was wiped off the face of the planet and the fact let's talk about fiduciary, right. How can you be a fiduciary at the largest organization in the world that you work for the organization, you don't work for your clients. 

21:10
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah, that's one of the things, Cary, that I've been we've been talking about having this conversation for quite a while, but you're working through the things you're working through on your side, respectful of your timelines and everything else. That's one of the things I was excited to talk to you about. Right. You go from this independent so I learned a lot in this conversation that I didn't know from our previous conversations with how family financial research and why and what happened there. I didn't know that before we talk to date. 

21:41
Cary Carbonaro
Right. 

21:42
Charlie Van Derven
I envision this as you're ramping up a very independent practice and then acquired by Goldman. Right. So how crazy is that? Most people go the other way, first off. 

21:54
Cary Carbonaro
Exactly. 

21:57
Charlie Van Derven
Most people go to captive and they go, wait a second, I can't really serve my clients. I'm serving a firm. I to want serve people, not corporations. It happens to you and it happens to you not because of any decisions. You made the opposite direction. 

22:12
Cary Carbonaro
Right. I literally thought I died for 1 second. When we found out it was happening for 1 second, I was like, wow, that's kind of prestigious. Within five minutes of joining them, everything was taken away from me. My whole entire career, my whole entire identity, everything that I stood for, everything that I believe in, gone, gone. I tell people, and it's kind of a joke, but it's not really a joke. Like, my arms were cut off, my legs cut off, and I had a gag around my mouth, and they're like, go. I'm like, I can't move and breathe or talk. 

22:55
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah, I mean, compliance being one side of it, but getting back to that right now you're serving Goldman, right. You're no longer serving these independent clients that you built through United Capital and your experiences prior. 

23:11
Cary Carbonaro
All my clients stayed because of me. 

23:16
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah. 

23:17
Cary Carbonaro
Nobody wanted to goldman. They just wanted to be with me because I'm their adviser. 

23:23
Charlie Van Derven
I think that's an important lesson right there, too, right, for our listeners, even if you are at a Goldman or any other let's call it big box, if you will. Maybe that's a derogatory way to say it, but that is what it is, right? If you're at one of those, at a big broker dealer, a big captive broker dealer, you're still the brand. Right. 

23:42
Cary Carbonaro
Well, what's interesting is it's interesting because if you are at a big name, there are some people who are with you because of the name. Sure, there's a credibility factor there's 100% because of the name, but United Capital wasn't a name, and I was a name, so my clients were with me because of me. 

24:06
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah, but for anybody who is thinking that independence is in their future. 

24:11
Cary Carbonaro
Right. 

24:12
Charlie Van Derven
You've got to do everything you can to make sure that client realizes they're working with you and that the firm that backs them may offer it may offer this confidence and stability and credibility, but it's important depending on where your career is taking you. It's important to reinforce your personal brand often, frequently, make sure that they understand. 

24:41
Cary Carbonaro
Yeah, but the problem is, with most of the big places, you can't have a personal brand for exactly that reason. 

24:47
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah, well, your website looks like everybody else's website. 

24:53
Cary Carbonaro
I came in what's crazy is I actually came into Goldman with my own brand, and they were like, oh, no, we are shutting her down immediately. She can't have anything. It's really funny because my friend Jamie Fury Higgins, who wrote the book Bully My Story of Money Misogyny at Goldman Sachs So when I talked to her, she was like, I can't even believe that you lasted as long as you did at Goldman. And I said, Neither can I. I was trying to get out the entire time with an attorney. Unsuccessfully. That's another whole story. She said you came in to Goldman with a name with the brand not needing them, and that doesn't work. Yeah, they want you to need them. Have to need them and can't operate without them. It was 100% mismatch from day one. 

25:44
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah. Crazy. As much as you can share, Cary, better where those lines are as far as your relationship or your departure from Goldman. What does that look like? Right. So you lasted three years since 2019. 

26:03
Cary Carbonaro
Was COVID, which made it longer. Which made it longer than expected, but yeah. Day one, we go there, we have to sign this contract where we can't compete for two years or they use the old one. That was three years. I had a two year or three year non compete, depending on which contract they were going through. 

26:28
Charlie Van Derven
Your clients, you brought them? 

26:30
Cary Carbonaro
Yeah. 

26:30
Charlie Van Derven
Oh, my God. 

26:32
Cary Carbonaro
Well, no. According to them, they own the clients. 

26:35
Charlie Van Derven
I don't own any yeah, but according but they came through your growth at United Capital that yeah. I put my hands together. If you're watching on YouTube, I feel like I'm being bound. I don't know, Cary, I have so much empathy for that situation where these are relationships that you created. Goldman buys them, buys those relationships. Unbeknownst to you, anyway, so I don't have to kick that horse. Right. What are you doing behind the scenes? As much as you can share again, Cary. 

27:08
Cary Carbonaro
Yeah, I know. I actually don't know how much I can share, except that this is my story, and so I'm allowed to speak of my story and my experiences. At least that's what Jamie said when she wrote her book. She wrote her story and her opinion and her view of the world. 

27:23
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah. 

27:23
Cary Carbonaro
This is my opinion, my view, and my view of the world and my experiences. I had to hire an attorney to try to get out of the contract, which I hired multiple attorneys and wound up with one for a longer amount of time for, let's say, two and a half years, and was told all the things I can't do, which is pretty much almost everything. I mean, every answer was no. I'm at Goldman. Goldman tells me no 150 times. Every request I get a no. I actually wrote a story. I'm a CFP board ambassador, which I've been since 2014. What part of the things that you do is I write about women and money because that's my specialty and my niche and what I believe in and what I'm passionate about. The CFP board came to me and said, can you please write an article about five mistakes that women make about money? 

28:22
Cary Carbonaro
I said, absolutely, I write it up. I said, you gotta give me a really long lead time because, it's Goldman and there's going to be a hundred people looking at it. I really, really thought it would be okay. And so I write the article. I write it in, like, five minutes. I send it out, I wait the time frame to get it back. They come back and they said, the executive office is uncomfortable with this blog post. It's filled with sexist tropes and has no value. 

28:52
Charlie Van Derven
Wow. 

28:53
Cary Carbonaro
I literally was in tears for, like, a week, and I'm like, do they think I'm a man? Literally, like, okay, my name is unisex. Maybe they think I'm a man who wrote this article, and maybe if I was a man, it could come across as sexist. Anything that has ever come out of my mouth as a woman and as a female advocate could never be sexist because that's not the place I'm coming from. I'm coming from the complete opposite of that. So, anyway, it never saw the light of day, and that was so depressing to me. I had asked so many times for so many things, and I got no, like, 170 times. I just said to somebody, should I stop asking? They said, yes, you should stop asking. It was so demoralizing. I mean, just so horrible, not being able to have a voice and not being able to have an opinion and not being able to do anything. 

29:47
Cary Carbonaro
In 2019, when I came to Bolton, I was actually the Investopedia Top 100 list. I was number four in the country. Wow. Yeah. 

30:00
Charlie Van Derven
Awesome. 

30:00
Cary Carbonaro
Well, 2019, that was when I walked into Boldman. By 2020, I was in the top 100. By 2021, I was off the list. Goldman did exactly what they wanted to do. They wanted to erase me. And they did. 

30:18
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah. Homogenize. Everything. Well, Cary let's get back there. We can get you back there. I think first off, hold all those articles back. The date is coming quickly, actually. It's just not too far off. 

30:31
Cary Carbonaro
Right. 

30:32
Charlie Van Derven
If we got to selfpublish that stuff, we'll selfpublish that stuff. We'll get it out there. 

30:36
Cary Carbonaro
No, I'm already ready. I'm already shopping at the Bit and ready to get back out there again. I mean, I feel like this is now the second time in my career where I died and came back. I died when I went through my divorce and came back. I died when I went through Goldman and now I'm coming back. 

30:53
Charlie Van Derven
How energizing is that? It hurts, but how energizing? 

30:59
Cary Carbonaro
I've been here before. I can do it. I've been here. 

31:05
Charlie Van Derven
You've got so much passion for what you do and the people you serve. I'm excited to see what the third iteration of Cary Carbonara is. What does that look like? Again, we're going to air after your obligation is done. 

31:22
Cary Carbonaro
Right? 

31:23
Charlie Van Derven
What does that look like? If you share what you can, it's going to come out. 

31:30
Cary Carbonaro
I don't know if they would be considered small or midsize RAA. I'm going to be like number employee number 65. It's an independent RAA fiduciary fee only based in the Northeast. I'm going to be head of Women in wealth for them. I get to do what I want to do. They actually want me to do what I want to do. I mean, they want me to do what I want to do so bad that at one point I said no to them and they said, we're going to try to find somebody to fill that slot. They tried, but they couldn't find anybody. And then I said yes to them. They're really excited and I'm really excited. And they wanted me the most. That's why I decided to go there, because I wanted to be wanted after going through what I just went through. 

32:17
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah, for sure. Now you get to stay in Orlando for that. 

32:19
Cary Carbonaro
Yes. Well, my clients are in Florida and New York mainly. So I'm mainly East Coast based. I mean, I'll go anywhere that the client. If I have a good fit for the client, I will work with them from wherever. Zoom has been very interesting for the past couple of years where we're doing it like this. 

32:41
Charlie Van Derven
Well, what's cool is you and I are like maybe an hour and a half from each other. 

32:44
Cary Carbonaro
We're really close. 

32:45
Charlie Van Derven
We won't have to be Zoomed for long. Get on for a cup of coffee or something like that. 

32:49
Cary Carbonaro
Exactly. 

32:50
Charlie Van Derven
Are you aware of a group and this is a plug for a friend of mine who I think is doing great things for the industry, females in finance. 

32:57
Cary Carbonaro
Cheryl. 

32:58
Charlie Van Derven
Hickerson. Yeah, I got so much respect for Cheryl. I should say Cheryl's not sponsoring the show but maybe Cheryl maybe we can talk about that. She's doing such great things for women in the industry. It's not just a group for women, it's for men supporting as well. I'm part of it. We did a webinar with coach Joe Lucas, who is down in Fort Lauderdale, actually. He's in Melbourne Beach. He's Magellan network, and he's a sponsor of Cheryl's, and so she's been blowing that up. So anyways, doing such great things. It's not just women, but it is really in support of that piece of the industry. 

33:35
Cary Carbonaro
Yeah. 

33:36
Charlie Van Derven
I think right now, Cary, you might know better than I am, because you're a pioneer. Might be 13 or 14% of the industry is female, whereas I can tell you a decade ago. 

33:47
Cary Carbonaro
So technically it's 20. So it's the 80 20 rule. However, what's interesting on that 20% is how many of those women are in support positions. 

34:00
Charlie Van Derven
Interesting. 

34:00
Cary Carbonaro
You've got support positions, you've got teaching positions, you've got operations positions, taking care of clients positions, which I always keep asking the CFP board for. I would like to see, out of those 20%, how many are actually rainmakers and the number is small. I mean, I would say it's probably less than five, maybe 5%. So there's not that many. It really is a small number. It's a really small number. Being one of them, I know it's a small I know how small it is. 

34:39
Charlie Van Derven
My advisor is a woman yay. A rainmaker and an old friend, somebody I've known for years and actually was a coaching client. That's how I met that's how I met her, was a coaching client. Yeah, there was a different level of nurturing there that I found from the men I knew. Of course, I don't want to create some kind of political banter about that, but there was a different level of taking an interest. I don't want to say mothering, but kind of . Right? 

35:11
Cary Carbonaro
Well, I think it's more on the empathy side. Yeah, I agree completely, because women are just better at that. I'm not saying anything bad about men. I'm just saying that's one of women's strengths. When my clients have to be pulled back from the edge, I'm telling them, I hear you, I feel you. Nobody likes to lose money. I'm feeling the same thing that you're feeling. I hear you. I'm with you. I'm getting you through this. I honestly don't know what the men are saying, but I feel like the emotional connection is very strong with a woman. 

35:54
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah, I agree. It was good because we had a friendship. Right. It started as a friendship. It didn't start as a client advisor relationship. 

36:03
Cary Carbonaro
Right. 

36:04
Charlie Van Derven
We knew each other in a different place. She knew what my missions were in life and family and not only that, but travel and outdoors and things like that. Anyway, so that's so cool. You get such a great story, and I know parts of it are very painful, and parts of it are wonderful. And you know what's funny? 

36:26
Cary Carbonaro
You haven't asked me how many clients I moved. 

36:29
Charlie Van Derven
Well, the only thing I first off, I don't know what I can touch on, right? I asked him about that four year break. That four years where you had to kind of check out, and that was maintenance mode for you for the best that you could do, because it was eight, nine, and were going through the stuff we're going through then. Let me ask you, how many clients are you going to retain? 

36:51
Cary Carbonaro
So it's already done. I took 90%. 

36:54
Charlie Van Derven
Awesome. That's so good. 

36:56
Cary Carbonaro
The 10% that I didn't take, which is interesting, is the people that came to me while I was at. 

37:03
Charlie Van Derven
Golden yeah, there you go. 

37:06
Cary Carbonaro
They don't know me as long of a time frame. They've never met me in person. It was during COVID and they came to me while I was a Goldman. It's funny because everyone's like, you should be super, super proud with the oh, my gosh. I'm just like, I can't believe I lost 10%. 

37:32
Charlie Van Derven
Naturally also, like, to your point, right? If you had a zoom relationship with them, I can feel your passion through zoom right now. I'm sure they felt your passion, but they're aligned with the Goldman brand. Right? And that's what I speak about. Again, your story is different than most. For that 32 year old adviser who came out of college for the last seven to ten years in a captive environment, and they're done serving a firm, they want to serve clients purely without the pressures of that firm. The 612 18 months leading up to that transition man relationship is everything at that point that it's not important all the time. If in your head that's your move, whether it's a year out or whatever it is, building that intimacy with your clients is so important today. They're not just another person on a spreadsheet, right? They're not just on a report. 

38:26
Cary Carbonaro
Well, I think my clients know how much I care for them way beyond just numbers. It's interesting because the day before I resigned from Goldman, there was an article that came out in RA a biz about what Goldman and Jodoran is doing with my division, and that they were going to hire thousands of kids out of college, 22 year olds, to serve the United Capital clients. I said to my husband the entire time I was there, they think I can be replaced with a 22 year old. And he's like, no, you're crazy. You're crazy. And I'm like here. It isn't an article. They think I can be replaced with a 22 year old. That's how much they don't understand consumers and people. My clients are not going to be okay with being with a 22 year old that knows nothing. Yeah. 

39:22
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah. No, experience hasn't been throughout. 

39:24
Cary Carbonaro
And you know what? And I always said, you know what? If I was 22 years old starting out at Goldman, I think it would have been okay because I didn't know what I didn't know. I would have just followed what they told me to do. I would have been okay with that, but not at where I am in my career. 

39:43
Charlie Van Derven
It just doesn't work. Yeah. And for that 22 year old, right. I'd like, what a great training ground. What a great place to kind of cut your teeth and understand what the industry is all about and get a full picture of the landscape for a lot of people. And it's for a lot of people. I coach marital advisors and mortgage advisors. There are people that are in those environments that they don't want anything different. And that's great. That's absolutely fine. For that entrepreneurial minded graduated with their finance degree and really with an altruistic approach to what they were about to do as a financial planner, and then they find that their ability to sell or the speed at which they dial the phone becomes their most important asset when they walk through that door. One of those big firms that's more important in many cases than their altruistic approach to their clients. 

40:41
Cary Carbonaro
Right. 

40:43
Charlie Van Derven
Really, this shows for those people that are in that environment, certainly there's benefits to being there. There are benefits to being there long term, but they know there's something better for them, something that suits them better. 

40:56
Cary Carbonaro
Well, in my experience with Goldman, they want you to be interchangeable, like an interchangeable widget. They don't want you to have good, deep client relationships they don't want you to have. I mean, I used to see clients at my house because I had home office, which I had been doing for 20 years. When they found out, they went ballistic and they said, you will never do that again. Well, guess what? I'm doing it again because now I'm not with Goldman. My clients love coming to my house. I have it set up for them. It's super comfortable. They know where I live. They know everything about me. They know my life the way I know their life. It's an interchangeable relationship, and it's not a oneway. I'm not an interchangeable widget, and I'm a human being, and so are they. That's the way I like to approach it. 

41:48
Cary Carbonaro
We're talking about people's lives and human beings, not widgets. 

41:54
Charlie Van Derven
You're awesome. I just got chills, as you were saying that right. I'm better for knowing you like, no, you really care. You're cool if you're open to it. I'm going to make that coffee happen sooner than later. We get down to Universal and we got pastors at Universal. So we get down there. I don't know during the summer, we don't go too much, but now that we're coming into cooler season, we'll get down there a couple of times a week, I'll dump a family off a Universal and we'll go have a cup of coffee. That's so cool. Cary, thank you so much for taking the time out of your busy schedule. I am so excited to see what happens. I don't remember the date specifically, but November, you've had 42 days, 17 hours and 39 minutes. You know what I mean? It's going to be fun to watch what happens in the next iteration of your career. 

42:55
Charlie Van Derven
I can only imagine you've got a competitive spirit to you as well. I can only imagine you're going to reach heights that probably you would not have even hit without the Goldman experienced, right? I mean, that's got a lot of fire under your b***. I'm excited to watch it happen. 

43:10
Cary Carbonaro
Thank you. Well, I'm excited to be reborn again. 

43:15
Charlie Van Derven
Yeah, it's inspiring, right? So inspiring. And take off the shackles and be. 

43:21
Cary Carbonaro
Able to imply my wings were cut and now I'm going to grow my wings back. So I'm excited about that. 

43:28
Charlie Van Derven
That is so awesome. That is so awesome. So, for everybody listening and thank you, I know your time is super valuable and you spending it with me and Cary today, that's awesome. Thank you for doing that. That's like the best compliment we can get is you actually carving out time in your day to listen to Racoective. Cary, let me ask you before we go, for those listeners of ours, are you okay being a resource? People are going through some difficult times. We found each other on LinkedIn, so. 

43:59
Cary Carbonaro
I used to not be able to even respond to LinkedIn, but now that I am out of Goldman, I can respond to LinkedIn. You can send me a message and then we can figure it out from there. 

44:11
Charlie Van Derven
Awesome. So very cool. We'll be looking out for the landing spot within just a month, Cary. Just a month. Thank you again for listening to RIA Collective. If you like this episode, please subscribe so you don't miss any of the future episodes. Of course, if you've got friends that you think would benefit from this show, turn them on to it, please. We don't have any big sponsors or anything, so when you pass the word along, that's how we grow and bring great advice from people like Cary who have been through a lot of different roles in the industry. Also if somebody who's had great experience in financial services and you think we should interview them, certainly Charlie Van Durbin. EasyGo to find on LinkedIn. RIA Collective.com is the website. You can get past episodes there and I hope you make it a great day and inspire people where you're today. 

45:00
Charlie Van Derven
So, Cary, thank you so much for being here and all the listeners, thank you.